Monday, December 11, 2006

Payment upfront please

Glengarry Leads comment, in my paying for it post raised a number of issues for me.

I can see where he is coming from. I have had some negative experiences with some regular clients, and am not prepared to leave payment till last. I tend to give everyone the benefit of the doubt until I am proven wrong.

I had two regular clients who intentionally short changed me, and who are now blacklisted. I think what some men do, is wait until you have developed a certain level of trust with them, and you are unlikely to believe that they would con you, and use this opportunity to do so.

As Jeanette Angell mentions in her book, and which I raise here a sure thing is not a sure thing until your money is in your pocket and you are out the door.

Mr Swot told me that whenever he pays upfront, the performance of the escort is poor, and when he leaves it till last he has a better experience. This is his experience, and is true for him.

I think what some clients need to bear in mind, is that you could be perceived as high risk if you do not pay upfront. I actually resent having to ask a client for payment. I rarely do, in fact in most cases, the envelope is handed to me, before the client sits down.

Why should I have to ask?

Okay, there are have been occasions when I have not been paid upfront and it has been okay. Sometimes the conversation has been so riveting, that I have forgotten.

However if I am not paid upfront, and leave it to the end, and the client pulls a fast one, who can I blame,other than myself?

I have read countless threads on messageboards of escorts being conned, and frankly I am not prepared to take that risk.

I have been bitten by regulars who I thought were okay. Unfortunately not every client is as honest as Glengarry Leads.

Have a good week.

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I can appreciate both sides of the argument. I think if I was an escort I would want to make it clear prior toi meeting the client that the exact amount in cash should be placed in an unsealed envelope in advance and handed to the escort at the start of the appointment. (Here is the US, for legal reasons, you might place it on a table or visible place.)

Personally I do not patronize escorts, though I have visited a handful in the past.

Now with the girls I have sex with in the Dominican Republic, I would never give them the money until all services had been provided. Paying in advance would be make perfunctory service much more likley. Actually what I do is this. Say I budget 2000 pesos for the sexual encounter. There will be some bargaining, and I will make my final offer 1500 pesos. Then, after much reflection, I will tell the girl that if she is as good as she claims she is--they all claim to be brilliant--then I will give her a 500 peso bonus.

Once she passes around the information to her friends that I paid her a 33% bonus, her friends will all be wanting a piece of the action too, and will be vying to outperform each other in a spirit of (friendly?) competition.

I think in some other countries, it works that way too. You pay at the end. I wonder how often they get conned though?

Have you got enough leche for all the girl's friends in DR when they want to outperform her?
And now you sort of prove my (hidden) point. The money is _always_ paramount. The article that prompted this discussion talked about how she felt that guys (often mistakably) assume that the girl cares most about the money. I think it is possible for the girl to be genuine in having positive feelings for the guy, but trust me, the money is the real boyfriend ;-)

On my local TER board, I'm embroiled in a very nasty discussion with a few local escorts. One of them posted a message saying how a very nice 1st time client had visited her and then offered to pay her in advance for another appointment (if she'd offer a discount). This escort thought it was a great idea, and encouraged all of the ladies to use this method as their main way of offering discounts to regulars. I piped-in and said "why not offer the same discount, but allow the gent to keep custody of the money until the appointment?"...Needless to say, the women went absolutely ballistic. Saying that they were established providers and how dare I "not trust them". My own personal experience has been that escorts (even ones with stellar reputations) are often prone to sudden "retirement" or mere vanishing. I think it is fine to have continuing relationships with them, but being that there is an aire of seediness to this industry, guys should always hang on to their cash. As should the girls.

I think it sucks that men have ripped you off in the past. And I think that fact sort of demonstrates well that in this buisness, there really is no true "friendhship" between most providers and punters. Money gets in the way. Even in the most trrusting of situations, someone tries to get away with the money.

Interestingly, I have been reading a lot of the practice of seeing escorts in Brazil. In Brazil, it is the custom for the man to pay at the end of the session. And from what I read, the girls in Brazil are known to be quite 'giving' compared to ladies elsewhere. It is interesting how things are different in different countries.

And I think if you conned a Brazillian girl, you might not live to con again. They are a fiery breed, these Brazilians. ;-)

Leche does not come into it. Call me kinky if you like, but one of the things I like to do is have sex with more than one girl in a day. If you read my blog--not that I would encourage anyone to do so--you will see that on a number of occasions I have had sex with three women the same day, once had a foursome (me and three women) and once even had five girls in one day--possibly a bit self-indulgent.

An ideal day for me would include a one-hour massage, swimming some laps, sex with a girl in the afternoon and then some more at bedtime, possibly with two women, though in general my preference is for one-on-one.

I remember a girl in the Dominican Republic who I met while she was "hitchhiking" at night. (Right!).

She agreed to spend the night with me for a ridiculously small amount of about $20. However, she needed money to pay a babysitter first. So she came to my hotel, we had sex, then I paid her and she went home to get a babysitter. This was late at night and I fell asleep, not expecting to see her again, especially as the moto taxis would cost her $3. However at 1:00 a.m. she was back as promised and stayed the night.

A very heartwarming story, except that the next afternoon she returned and asked for another $10!

But I would agree about not going the "prepaid" route. Even with a well intentioned provider, too many things can go wrong in the meantime.


I don't know how many girls get conned, but I recently read an account on a bulletin board of a guy who refused to pay a girl because he felt that she had not stayed the agreed time. (These disagreements can easily occur if there is not a good rapport and if there are language problems too. Americans tend to think that if they hire a girl for two hours, then they can have sex as many times as they like in that time. Girls tend to think that once the guy comes, then they are off the clock. When I hear about these disputes I tend to be more sympathetic to the girls.)

Anyway, the girl came back with the police and the guy ended up having to pay her, and of course cover the "travel expenses" of the police as well, or else face arrest.

I have never been to Brazil and don't speak Portuguese, though my Spanish is functional, but I think that in places like Brazil, or anywhere you are a foreigner, you have to beware of the girl returning with a friend or two. Life is cheap in the third world and the cops are not well paid.
I always used to pay at the end ...

... until I found myself forgetting - to my embarrassment but even more to that of the escort. I knew it was so bad to make her have to remind me.

I used to say that it was because it was so good I forgot I was paying. And there is much truth in that.

I know it is good practice for an escort to count out the money in front of a client at the beginning so that there can be no misunderstandings. But that has only happened to me once. I found it spoiled the rest of the appointment. Perhaps part of the fantasy is that I'm not paying!

When I've discussed this with escorts, few have mentioned experiences such as Nia describes. I find it so despicable that a regular should short change. Someone new pulling a fast one - but a regular!!!???

A couple of escorts have told me of times when both she and the client forgot - but on each occasion the client came back with the money.

Such a difficult contract - when there is a pretense that it is not a commercial interaction at all!!!

You say you always used to pay at the end.

Why and when did you change?
Actually - I find I still tend most often pay at the end. Very few escorts I see make a point about asking for the money upfront.

The reason for starting to pay at the beginning of the appointment was having almost forgotten a couple of times I wanted to avoid the embarrassment for an escort in having to remind me.
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